And just as if to prove the last post, recent US trial sentence reaction of the mother of a shot and very obvious burglar (while this was then not part of discussion):
As much as I would feel with a mother, and I feel with many mothers, I get a problem here.
First, the boy definitely broke into someone else's property. Maybe he did several times. There is no statement that anyone excuses for causing the home-owner and wife massive anxiety. Long-time fear can result in unwishful reactions. To have phantasies of self-defense by attacking the attacker is psychologically 'normal'. Not normal would be to feel and state (at the hair dresser, for instance) that you cherish a constant violation of your home and prefer to live in a state of constant insecurity where you never know when you might be slain in your bed.
And secondly because the statement as above does not implicate what these words really mean:
It means what many children living in Germany experience growing up the recent one and a half decades: Being bullied by family clans in any personal conflict, being threatened with 'I will bring my brothers' or 'cousins' and so forth in any children's dispute. Underlying, every child clearly receives the message 'we/they have other rights because we/they are stronger as we/they stick in group' (which is in other words bullying; consider whether you belong to the 'we' group or the 'they') and this is imprinted from early childhood time onwards. Thanks to some 'cultural misunderstandings', nurtured by people who obviously have no clue what they do, behind the veil of fighting discrimination, discrimination is pushed forward.
The mocking of democracy to me consists in the almost natural way to demand justice from another country's court, while oneself practicing the 'law of the physical stronger' in the street and here clearly admitting it, even raising it to a privilege. Patriarchy though is most often carried on and nurtured by women who grew up in such simple system and who feed it to their sons and daughters.
Brainwash.
And counter-caricature of all European education and all those hard fought for small wins for same rights for everyone since the French Revolution.
Why would someone who relies on physical power 'to protect' through a male offspring and defend this as a 'cultural privilege', at the same time and when it is convenient rely on justice in the other Western country they live in?
Why point out the son and 'brother' (after having given birth to two girls, should girls not have the same value in a civilized society? Or what is going on in that woman's head?) if people at the same time mobilize the Government of their guest country to support?
It is the same attitude which would declare their 'culture' as reasoning and excuse for violation of other people's rights.
As a native Pan-European (not limited to the current EU at all) Mix Female I have NEVER received support by my own government, state attorney or police in a conflict I was threatened, neither when I was physically violated, nor when was my daughter nor my son. Neither when I was threatened recently by a female neighbor of that same nationality as Ms Dede is, with gang-rape to be executed by her four brothers to 'teach me behavior' (according to what she assumes appropriate in her little horizon). Imagine how relaxing this is for a natural friendly neighborhood and intercultural understanding. Almost forgot to add the statement of her 6 year old son supporting her: 'They will put their penis in your butt and that will hurt'.
THIS is what is supported by the German State attorney.
But this is also not new to me; I was for a decade working with and for violated women and children, and it is almost standard to not act before the prospective victim is a real one (then certainly shut up). Include what constant threat as 'approved environment' means for growing-up children. And it gets damned tough to educate children with regard to Human rights and ethics if the school yard (and the way home) is a permanent offense.
This is only a little episode of what I have experienced in Germany over the last few decades. This is the state of the art in so-called 'civilization' who were so strongly behind a court case in the US for someone whose first nationality and apparently also socialization is not Western-European at all.
Dig and you will find ... a lot more for sure.
As long as it is Western (female) victims with no strong patriarch lobby behind (and no brothers to 'protect'), this is obviously fine. Or maybe a kind of self-destructive pattern, who knows. The Germans suffer lots of depressions so that I would not be too much surprised.
Well. Got the message.
I may also not self-defend myself or my children against a majority of physically bullying males who do neither speak the country's language (otherwise maybe some rational communication would have worked) nor relate to local laws regarding systematic theft as crime. O.k., forgot, for some such is normal - to me not. Or at least, not by now. But the above was just recently stated by another state attorney (seems I was a little reluctant in recent time to just handing over civil and human rights):
If I defend myself in a physical threat situation after many, many times being offended, this is 'wrong'.
Got the message.
When any objective discussion is suppressed and especially journalism as what we call the 'fourth power' fails, the opposite most likely will happen, and that is what is kicked-off, still in the form of demonstrations, by the end of the year. It really gets hard to NOT see causal connections.
It is counterproductive to criminalize people who try to name and dissolve conflicts with words and in open discussions for democratic rules and rights, and by this cause the steam pot pressure rise.
If intelligent, background oriented conversation is suppressed, only dumb and opportunists will reign. Who cherishes fruitful inter-relations of our various cultures and heritages can not support rigid, prejudged, manipulated suppression and eradication of all basic values of humanity oriented society.
Questions arise like: Is this wanted? Bring people down to black-and-white approach so that they can more easily be steered and directed? A very dangerous game, anyway. Or is it fear why they sacrifice civil society because who streamlines in time may look forward to a better career? Take care, such has already happened before and we should have learned the lessons. Or is it just geopolitical interests? What if this strategy forms up other what I call 'unholy alliances'?
So many questions are not answered and the truth no one will tell openly.
Just too many still feel safe in their rat race idyls, so that those who stand in for SAME (!) rights and stand up against hypocrisy and bigotry are usually the weaker parties who already feel the results.
And some very few who certainly realize due to access to information that many things go terribly wrong, globally. Mankind had so much to prosper and move ahead in hands.
Lyn
'Gulcin said her two older daughters are devastated because they always counted on Diren to protect them.'
As much as I would feel with a mother, and I feel with many mothers, I get a problem here.
First, the boy definitely broke into someone else's property. Maybe he did several times. There is no statement that anyone excuses for causing the home-owner and wife massive anxiety. Long-time fear can result in unwishful reactions. To have phantasies of self-defense by attacking the attacker is psychologically 'normal'. Not normal would be to feel and state (at the hair dresser, for instance) that you cherish a constant violation of your home and prefer to live in a state of constant insecurity where you never know when you might be slain in your bed.
And secondly because the statement as above does not implicate what these words really mean:
It means what many children living in Germany experience growing up the recent one and a half decades: Being bullied by family clans in any personal conflict, being threatened with 'I will bring my brothers' or 'cousins' and so forth in any children's dispute. Underlying, every child clearly receives the message 'we/they have other rights because we/they are stronger as we/they stick in group' (which is in other words bullying; consider whether you belong to the 'we' group or the 'they') and this is imprinted from early childhood time onwards. Thanks to some 'cultural misunderstandings', nurtured by people who obviously have no clue what they do, behind the veil of fighting discrimination, discrimination is pushed forward.
The mocking of democracy to me consists in the almost natural way to demand justice from another country's court, while oneself practicing the 'law of the physical stronger' in the street and here clearly admitting it, even raising it to a privilege. Patriarchy though is most often carried on and nurtured by women who grew up in such simple system and who feed it to their sons and daughters.
Brainwash.
And counter-caricature of all European education and all those hard fought for small wins for same rights for everyone since the French Revolution.
Why would someone who relies on physical power 'to protect' through a male offspring and defend this as a 'cultural privilege', at the same time and when it is convenient rely on justice in the other Western country they live in?
Why point out the son and 'brother' (after having given birth to two girls, should girls not have the same value in a civilized society? Or what is going on in that woman's head?) if people at the same time mobilize the Government of their guest country to support?
It is the same attitude which would declare their 'culture' as reasoning and excuse for violation of other people's rights.
As a native Pan-European (not limited to the current EU at all) Mix Female I have NEVER received support by my own government, state attorney or police in a conflict I was threatened, neither when I was physically violated, nor when was my daughter nor my son. Neither when I was threatened recently by a female neighbor of that same nationality as Ms Dede is, with gang-rape to be executed by her four brothers to 'teach me behavior' (according to what she assumes appropriate in her little horizon). Imagine how relaxing this is for a natural friendly neighborhood and intercultural understanding. Almost forgot to add the statement of her 6 year old son supporting her: 'They will put their penis in your butt and that will hurt'.
THIS is what is supported by the German State attorney.
But this is also not new to me; I was for a decade working with and for violated women and children, and it is almost standard to not act before the prospective victim is a real one (then certainly shut up). Include what constant threat as 'approved environment' means for growing-up children. And it gets damned tough to educate children with regard to Human rights and ethics if the school yard (and the way home) is a permanent offense.
This is only a little episode of what I have experienced in Germany over the last few decades. This is the state of the art in so-called 'civilization' who were so strongly behind a court case in the US for someone whose first nationality and apparently also socialization is not Western-European at all.
Dig and you will find ... a lot more for sure.
As long as it is Western (female) victims with no strong patriarch lobby behind (and no brothers to 'protect'), this is obviously fine. Or maybe a kind of self-destructive pattern, who knows. The Germans suffer lots of depressions so that I would not be too much surprised.
Some people are more equal than others.
Well. Got the message.
I may also not self-defend myself or my children against a majority of physically bullying males who do neither speak the country's language (otherwise maybe some rational communication would have worked) nor relate to local laws regarding systematic theft as crime. O.k., forgot, for some such is normal - to me not. Or at least, not by now. But the above was just recently stated by another state attorney (seems I was a little reluctant in recent time to just handing over civil and human rights):
If I defend myself in a physical threat situation after many, many times being offended, this is 'wrong'.
Got the message.
Just to finish the other recent issue:
Press started heavily censoring in this country during this year when three topics became more and more discussed in public portals:
- Police behavior indicating abuse of power and the lack of transparency and proper persecution.
- Rise of crime and especially the brutality within committed by immigrants, also by second- and third-generation males and occurring problems with overflow by refugees.
- The Russia/Crimea/Ukraine Issue and people who did NOT prejudge one party.
When any objective discussion is suppressed and especially journalism as what we call the 'fourth power' fails, the opposite most likely will happen, and that is what is kicked-off, still in the form of demonstrations, by the end of the year. It really gets hard to NOT see causal connections.
It is counterproductive to criminalize people who try to name and dissolve conflicts with words and in open discussions for democratic rules and rights, and by this cause the steam pot pressure rise.
If intelligent, background oriented conversation is suppressed, only dumb and opportunists will reign. Who cherishes fruitful inter-relations of our various cultures and heritages can not support rigid, prejudged, manipulated suppression and eradication of all basic values of humanity oriented society.
Questions arise like: Is this wanted? Bring people down to black-and-white approach so that they can more easily be steered and directed? A very dangerous game, anyway. Or is it fear why they sacrifice civil society because who streamlines in time may look forward to a better career? Take care, such has already happened before and we should have learned the lessons. Or is it just geopolitical interests? What if this strategy forms up other what I call 'unholy alliances'?
So many questions are not answered and the truth no one will tell openly.
Just too many still feel safe in their rat race idyls, so that those who stand in for SAME (!) rights and stand up against hypocrisy and bigotry are usually the weaker parties who already feel the results.
And some very few who certainly realize due to access to information that many things go terribly wrong, globally. Mankind had so much to prosper and move ahead in hands.
Lyn
